#7 Freelancer Spotlight - The freelance juggle and managing client boundaries with Lianne Harris

Aggie Meroni: 0:00

Hello and welcome to the freelance ads club podcast with me your host Aggie Meroni. Whether you're a veteran freelance ads manager, or just thinking about dipping your toe into the world of self employment, this podcast is for you. Every week, I'll be speaking about my own experiences as a freelance as manager, sharing a freelancer spotlights where I'll have a chat with one of the amazing members of the Freelancers Club, where I'll be asking guests to share their knowledge and experience in ads across all platforms and business. Don't forget to follow and subscribe on your favourite podcast platform so you never miss an episode. Welcome to this week's episode of the freelance ads club Podcast. Today I am joined by Leanne Harris who owns pin social, and we're going to be talking about one of the main reasons a lot of us go freelance. And that is to manage the Juggle just the general juggle of life, whether you've got kids, elderly, parents, dependents, pets, holidays, whatever it is that you're like, wants to squeezing around your working life. We're going to be hearing about the story, the struggle, why she became a freelancer, and we go off on a few tangents as well as per usual. So listen in and let me know what you think. Hi, Leanne, thank you so much for joining me today.

Unknown: 1:31

Hi, Aggie, thank you.

Aggie Meroni: 1:33

Please, could you introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about how you got to where you are today?

Unknown: 1:39

Yep. My name is Leanne Harris. I am the owner of pins social. I'm predominantly a Pinterest expert or specialist however you want to call it basically, I do everything Pinterest, whether that be organic or paid campaigns. I also do meta adverts as well. So that's anything Instagram and Facebook. I do do just general social media management. But to be honest, there's few and far between at the moment. So yeah, basically Pinterest. Whether you want a revamp or an audit, any help, I'm always here are amazing.

Aggie Meroni: 2:22

And how did you end up doing what you're doing? So

Unknown: 2:25

I actually started as a parenting blogger. I found that with my eldest, I've suffered from really bad postnatal depression. And being the old school emo I was it was all about poetry, writing and my feelings. So yeah, I started off as a blogger. And I found that I was doing really well with Pinterest back in the day when you can literally pin one pin to about 50 million boards. But yeah, so that seemed to be where it was. And then some other fellow bloggers asked me to give them a bit support and just kind of boost their account. I then became pregnant with twins, and was made redundant literally two months before they were born. So I had no choice really to go self employed. So I use my skills. And it's been five years now. So yeah, that

Aggie Meroni: 3:15

makes me so mad. so mad when I hear that happens to you. happens to so many women.

Unknown: 3:23

I know. But I was actually quite fortunate that we got told in the July before I was made redundant. So I was made redundant in February. But it was the whole office got shut. And we're all we're all part of a massive international law firm. So we were like small fry. But we got given the notice in the July and I said to my husband, right, everything we've got without eldest was neutral. I was like, I'm gonna milk them for all this worth, get all the maternity it was only statutory so it wasn't much but if I get statutory, we're gonna have this second child and we're going to be on to a winner I can then invest in the business and it will be brilliant. And then within a month I was pregnant with twins and I was like why this was not meant to happen that quick and number two, now we've got to have to rebuy everything because you can't just you can't have a single anything when it comes to twins you've literally just got duplicate it and the twin buggies and yeah so that was very interesting because I was expecting maybe three four months pregnant as I get made redundant just live a life of luxury. Now I was literally within two months. I was in hospital.

Aggie Meroni: 4:35

Oh no, that sounds so stressful. Oh yeah. How how lucky was it that you have this going on in the background with your Pinterest and blogging?

Unknown: 4:43

I know. I felt so stupid because I was doing the blogging and I was really fortunate that I was actually being paid for different gigs I remember V tech paid us to go to the is it that that catalogue where all the bikes go in Stratford because it just been after the Olympics. And my we got paid money to attend, we got given this massive tricycle. And then where they invited all these different people and they'd bought V tech toys. They literally they got the PR company just to go to Westfield to buy loads of V tech stuff. And now that we've opened the boxes, you might as well take it home, I must have got about 500 pounds worth of stuff all in one day. And so I did all that. And there was me sitting on my desk at lunchtime, do all my blog posts, and everyone looked at me like, What are you doing? And then afterwards, they're like, I need a job. And I've got my own job.

Aggie Meroni: 5:37

Yeah, so many freelancers stopped by side hustling. I don't know, then. I mean, I mean, Leanne is a member of the freelance Arts Club, so she's like, freelance focus episodes of the podcast. But there are so many in there that are still employed, or doing something slightly different and training up to become freelancers. So I think it's really a really great example of sometimes you're pushed before you like, do it. And it's good that you had it kind of ticking along before. Obviously, when I got made redundant, I was kind of like just thrown into it, because I hadn't even started doing as a side hustle yet. So everyone's situation is a little bit different. But today's episode, really, we're going to talk about this juggle, like a lot of freelancers choose to be freelancers, and don't really want to grow, they just literally just just and I say that you can't see me but I'm doing it is obviously not just being a freelancer, as we all know. But it's a choice to be a freelancer without expanding too much or becoming huge agency, because it's a lifestyle choice, and is very flexible around other commitments that you might have. So some people like have horses or travel or, you know, and Phil Yeah, do you wanna tell us a bit about why you're freelance,

Unknown: 6:59

because I've got twins. They're two years old. And I, very fortunately, I have three amazing young children. But I have got so at the end of this month, my eldest is going to be seven. But physically, he's like a four or five year old. So he's still Motability wise and trying to do the daily, I've got all of the older mums being like, Oh, they can get themselves dressed. And they can do this, and they can is really self sufficient. And I'm like, my child is a baby. So I've got him bless him. And then I've got my twins, I've just turned five. So I've found that since September, it's really where I've been able to escalate my business, I've also been able to focus on ads, which is something I've wanted to do for a while. So I'm really fortunate with that respect. I've also got a lot more time to train, which everyone knows in this industry, you need to be constantly learning. Everything changes, literally daily, they'll bring out a new feature. Pinterest, it used to be you get the inside knowledge, like, Oh, this is going to be happening. They're rolling out over the next few months, the new guys taken over from Google. And it's literally, this is new feature today. Oh, I'm not used to this. I'm normally used to experience and I can research. And now it's changing. But yes, my life literally hectic. I'm also the treasurer of my local PTA. I'm currently, whilst I'm working and dealing with the bank holiday juggle, and the half term and the pending summer holidays, which I'm dreading. I'm also currently juggling an additional disco for the PTA. And my husband might have a broken neck and right now what am I doing? But yeah,

Aggie Meroni: 8:52

I think it's really important to stress though, that this is why a lot of people become freelance, even if they don't have kids, because they have other interests. So you know, but they want to be part of an association, or you know, some people have like dependents, so it might be elderly parents now, maybe there's someone on well in their family, or maybe they just want to be able to just have a more chilled pace. I mean, I've never seen that you're a freelancer.

Unknown: 9:19

There is no child freelance. They might go into a being like, oh, I can do like two three hours a day. I can charge X amount a month. And then you find Saturday, Sunday again, email. Why is working? I thought you're only doing a couple of hours a day. Yeah, well, I'm, I can't stop now. You become addicted to your own business. I swear. It's just never ending but I do

Aggie Meroni: 9:39

think because obviously I don't have three kids. But I do have a son. And I'm so grateful that I am freelance now. Because they're ill all the time. Like things just happen like, you know, kind of in that sandwich generation now my parents are getting older, so they're having medical stuff happening. And I know that if I was employed, it'd be so much more stressful. especially in the industry that I used to work in, charged, it'd be really stressful and it just adds to already stressful situation.

Unknown: 10:08

So I found that one of my twins, we he's on the waiting list to be diagnosed autism. So he has an issue that when he gets overwhelmed, he pulls himself, which as a child was at his child, being in school, and pulling yourself, obviously is really difficult, but the teachers can't do anything to clean him. So I have to go in several times to clean him, which you would think oh, it's not too bad. scammer lunchbreak, etc. But I had it once that he had in the morning, he had a trip to go to the local library. So we we essentially live in a small village, we lived two roads away from the school. And in between, we're in between the library and the school. So it's literally like five minute walk. So we did this little library trip for an hour, he went back to school. And then in the afternoon, we had a school disco, which I do and I dealt with. So the both times he had me as I volunteer for the school, etc. But in that day, he proved himself nine times through stress. Yes. And I was just like, there is no employer in the world that would be happy once a day, potentially, they might be like, Okay, take it as your lunch break this and understanding, there will be no person at all that would allow that, it would have to be a case of look, I understand. Unfortunately, we're gonna have to let you go. And as a freelancer, when it's a bad day like that, I can literally just be like, Okay, I'm going to work tonight, just I'm not even going to bother with trying to work today. Or I can just complete cancer bla, right, I'll say to my husband, one day, this weekend, I'm going to have to work, you've got to take the kids out, or just deal with the kids whilst I go and sit in another room and work. And that's the benefits of freelancing you can literally just turn around block a today's write off. Let's juggle it another day. So yeah, I think that's the perks of freelancing.

Aggie Meroni: 12:09

Yeah, I have to say, though, even though, that is the perk, and I totally agree, that's what I that's probably the biggest thing for me at this stage of my life with what I have going on. It's like the best thing. So I find that after being employed for so long, so like 10 years, plus, I'm so institutionalised and I know it's something I've mentioned, like in other episodes, but even though we do have this flexibility, I still find myself completely panicking if something isn't within my nine to five. But then I'm like, just chill. Like, I still have to take a step back and go, I can just work around this. It's really wild. Yeah, I'm like, right and eat it. Like I'm getting better at it as well. Like, sometimes I really work hard. And then I kind of burn out a bit. And then I take it easy. It's like, you know, I don't think you ever get it right that you get the balance. No, I think the balance exists,

Unknown: 12:58

I want to try to keep to like, almost for me the 93. So then once the school's done, I can then sit at home, I think especially more so the Key Stage Two key stage one sorry SATs on next week. And I'm being told that my eldest got to read three times a week, and then he got the math three times a week, and then I've got the twins. And I'm like, Okay, so that's half hour a day, every single day, just on one topic sets an hour, every day. And I was like, if I got to be flexible in the evenings, and then during the day, it's it really it's, it's hard. And it's a case of trying to pick the best battle of the day. But yeah, it's hard. It really is hard

Aggie Meroni: 13:42

is prioritising Isn't it like is what, what really has to happen today. And what can I kick down the road? A little bit longer.

Unknown: 13:51

And controversially, we love controversy. I. So if anyone knows anything about bookbindings and children in school, my eldest who's in year two, is he essentially from year one should have been on recommended reading. So you've got all your bandings as you're learning, and then your recommended reading, essentially, he can just go and pick whatever book he wants to read, and just read it. He's fortunately got his Matilda esque style reading from me. But the teachers that know he's got to read three times a week and when I get that, but he's brilliant at reading. And when I'm at home, and I've got all this stuff going on with the twins. And the issues I've got with Matt and his potential autism. As I know he can read, he's reading in school. I volunteer for reading in the school as well because I know so if I just want to not let him read or want to allow him to read TS Eliot, the practical but because cats because he's obsessed with cats the musical at the moment. Why can't he read that rather than school? textbook reading peters out, but no, he's not. And then he then loses his break. And it's like, well, but what's the point? He's so past Key Stage rankings like just let it but yeah, controversially, but apparently I'm not allowed to do that and I'm like he can I know he reads he's going to do well.

Aggie Meroni: 15:20

Like this is obviously my son isn't at school age yet he starts in September. But isn't this the kind of thing you do white lies about and just say yes, we read three times a week.

Unknown: 15:30

This is what I'm thinking. My child is not the child that will he'll be like, No, I didn't. He's taking your blood. So when you read last night, no, but your mom wrote down. You did? No, I didn't. He's not the child that Black can. Yeah, I did. And get away with it. He's too honest. Yeah, so I can't why I came to the twins. They'll be like, Did you wait? Yeah, yeah. Here's the snitch, he comes down the stairs? Mom, they're doing this, they're doing that.

Aggie Meroni: 16:02

So with all this slight flexibility that you have, as a freelancer, do you have any systems that you've put in place, whether that's communicating with how you how you communicate with your clients, or what your official office hours are? How do you get those boundaries in place,

Unknown: 16:17

so I predominantly use WhatsApp, which probably isn't the best method, but I've got it the business WhatsApp, so if it's out of hours, they get bounced back. So essentially, they can keep on messaging me all they want. But I am not going to respond by also give them the same courtesy that if I message them on an evening, and I'd like I don't expect an answer to the morning, just so they know that I'm giving them a boundary that I'm also asking for back. I also have about 10 million notepads all on the go. So I currently have one that's got today's task one that's got tomorrow's task, because in case I complete all of my tasks today, I can make a start on tomorrow. Because you never know, by the end of the week, I might be tired, something might come up with the kids. So if I can get in the swing of things to get things done earlier in the week, it gives me some freedom towards the back end of the week.

Aggie Meroni: 17:12

You know, it's so interesting hearing how other people work, because I know some people like never on WhatsApp, because like everyone takes the movie. And you know, everything's done on a sauna. And I was like somebody, I'd love a pattern paper. And

Unknown: 17:27

for me when I have. So I currently have three, I've got your advantage plus notes. Plus

Aggie Meroni: 17:40

if anyone wants my nine pound advantage plus shopping campaign training, I'll put the link in the show notes.

Unknown: 17:46

Honestly, it's amazing is the best thing I've ever looked at any looks. I'm so happy. I was so destroyed. There was one client I was like, This is gonna be perfect. And she hasn't had enough sales to be able to put it through. Yeah. And I'm like, damn it. But yeah, so I'm just like, okay, work on other style of ads. And once I get that I can then convey over and it'll be fine. But yeah, so I've got them. I've got three notepads just for today. And then I've got four sat on the side. So they've just notes and different clients and seven on the go. This is why I think I've got ADHD, seven, nine times on the go all specify but differently.

Aggie Meroni: 18:23

Everyone's brain works differently. Yeah, right. So however it like your filing cabinet in your brain works. That's why there isn't a perfect system. So like, that's why so many people

Unknown: 18:32

think, yeah, I have tried, I've tried Asana Trello, air table, click up. I think I've tried all of them. And there's nothing that I can actually think I also tried dubsado for a CRM system, because I thought during the onboarding, and the process in might work easier by literally having it automated. When I worked in the law firm, there was a CRM system that they used. And it was amazing. It automatically set up when you had to chase someone itself, all the forms, and everything came up automatically. And also, this is amazing. But to get it all set up and prepped, I don't think I've got the time and patience and the cost to outsource it is just ridiculous at the moment. And so I want to get my husband to do it, but he would prefer to paint Warhammer models

Aggie Meroni: 19:26

as a bit of like marriage advice. Do not get your husband involved in your business. Just get the money put aside outsource.

Unknown: 19:33

Yeah, no, here. Listen, I know because he set up. He works in a mortuary but he also set up a computer system for his local Trust, which is hilarious because that's completely not what he's saying. I was like, Oh, if you've done that on your own, you can help me set this up. And he started doing it and I was just like, You're annoying me. You're too slow. Can you just

Aggie Meroni: 19:58

there are so many different and onboarding things. I mean, really, this is a good opportunity for me to say that I do have a free onboarding Trello, which I'll also link in the show notes as well. So if you're an freelance ads manager, and you want some ideas on what to include when you onboard a new client, it is meta specific, but it can be adapted, then you can click the link in the show notes to get access to that. I guess, one of the like, questions I'm asking everyone in this series of the podcast is has anything gone? Like really wrong for you as a freelancer? And have you learned a lesson from it?

Unknown: 20:35

I could talk about red flag clients all day long. I can talk about so useful. And a reason why you shouldn't really be using WhatsApp to communicate with your clients. I used to have a client when I was very low charging, which is also another downside. Big mistake, you usually find that the lower your clients pay, the more hassle they are and they asked for so much more. So I had a client who was a baker and from what I understand now, having done birthday cakes for having bought them from someone that I speak to quite regularly. Baking time is nighttime. So she would send me I'd like one to two o'clock in the morning 100 pictures through WhatsApp and I would say to her put it on a Google Drive. Because the quality we better show like No, I'm just going to send it to you from my phone. It's easier. So one two o'clock in the morning my phone's got buzz, buzz buzz, buzz, buzz. And then yeah, and then I would put things into the power work of my clients I usually do like a Google Sheets they've then got access, they can see literally everything nicely written and they see the pictures, the captions, etc. She was like no, I don't like that picture. Can you change up with this, but each cake she would send me about 30 or 40 different pictures. So I then said to her after a while of her constantly changing if you just send me the pictures that you would prefer to be used, I can then take from that selection so I don't have time to go through them. Okay, but if this is the case, the pictures I upload are going to be the ones that you prefer. Like you basically just tell me if you don't like that cake, then I'll change it for a different cake but the picture of that cake will be final because of the selection I will obviously go through and pick what ones I think are the best show now I don't like that one can you do this so after a while of tuna throw in she understood she will only send over a select few she wanted them to be cropped and to be changed with like filters and brightness and as an edit them. I was like your pictures your cakes should represent themselves I shouldn't be editing it's the product is changing the colours etc. She wasn't happy with that. She then didn't like the what I was saying in the captions. And this is all going through WhatsApp, but I think the icing on the cake ended up being the icing haha realise oh my god, the pawns Christmas Eve, she doesn't doesn't have children. But she knew that I had children. That Christmas Eve she asked me to completely change the schedule over Christmas. I'd already sent it to her three days prior and said, I'll send it to him on Thursday. This was on a Sunday. And I said I'm going to be at the office by tomorrow if you can confirm that. What I've done is okay, if I don't hear anything, it will be scheduled on the Saturday morning so I can then take time off of work with my family. Sunday night. She was like oh no, I've just done these last minute cakes. Can you do this, that and the other? And I was like, I'm really sorry, I can't show it. But I need them to go out there Christmas related. I know I'm well I'm really sorry. But I'm not doing any. The only things that I would potentially stretch to is doing an amendment, but I'm not adding and replacing anything. And then she got really angry. So I just I told her very nicely where she could stick it. Yeah,

Aggie Meroni: 24:13

I think now this is like a tricky subject. And it's taboo. I think in the freelance world like no one, as a freelancer likes to openly say that they've and this is again, the wording like the language I'm going to use is again quite taboo to fire a client, some people. You can't say that you fired a client. I was like, I fired the ass.

Unknown: 24:36

Sometimes it's got to be done. Oh, it really has. There's been a couple of clients that I've been wanting to get rid of. But you always want to make sure you've got a backup. It's like when your parents used to say to you make sure you've got a new job before you jack it in. And you always learned the hard way of just not having anything like when I've got no money to go to the cinema with my mates. But yeah, I have thoughts had a couple that I've wanted to, they've got their first. And it's just I think sometimes they might be okay clients, you just don't work well together. And sometimes your personalities just don't

Aggie Meroni: 25:12

fit. Yeah. So I think your story or your story, your account of that client, it just shows that you were really, really, really flexible for a very long time. And then she finally crossed that final boundary. And it's like, actually, that's not okay. And I think just out of human courtesy, it's Christmas Eve. Yeah. Why would she get angry? Like, I think if she ever said, What happened to a friend, they'd be like, you're being completely unreasonable on Christmas Eve to send lots of amends. No, that's yeah, it's just not done. It's like, I don't know it culturally, you just don't do that someone. So I think you're well within your rights to call that a day. And I think there are lots of situations where, and I can relate to this. I've done it. I've held on for too long. And you think I just need to nip this in the bud now because it's actually stressing me out. So I think that's actually a really good lesson. And I'm sure there have been a lot stronger in the future with with other clients to fit in.

Unknown: 26:08

I then switched on my business hours after that. He got to the point towards the end, but before it even sector, I was just doing that. And I would just ignore her. Because before, it would be like the ones and twos in the morning because I just don't sleep. When especially when the twins were little. I got up quite a lot anyway, so I'd respond. But now I'm just like now, I don't respond until I get back from school now used to respond at one or two in the morning. Yeah, because I was an idiot.

Aggie Meroni: 26:36

Again, this is another lesson. Don't do that.

Unknown: 26:39

Five years down the line. I'm like, No.

Aggie Meroni: 26:43

But you may I get emails at all hours of the day from people and I'm bad, like do check that I do read them. But I purposely never reply until the next day. And that's bad, because I always forget. So I'm usually one of these people that seems to something comes in it's replied to because I just I don't know, I just have to keep that, you know, just keep my inbox free. But yeah, it's sometimes you read things that you really don't want to read, you know, someone said, Oh, I'm not happy with this or get that. I'm feeling that. Yeah. And it's like, oh, the reason I check to be honest, but it's because you never know what accounts being restricted or what your accounts been disabled or if something's been hacked. And you kind of have to be a bit vigilant on that. So I'm always

Unknown: 27:24

prioritise your day as well, if you know that, right. I've done the nursery drop. Now I need to go and like literally, I can't just sit and do an easy morning, I've got to sort this out. At least you can kind of know what's lying ahead. no nasty surprises,

Aggie Meroni: 27:40

called so many days, there's no one else to pass it on to when you're a freelance. So you just have to deal with it. But you

Unknown: 27:47

know, certain things, even if you've got a VA, you're just not in their remit. Now.

Aggie Meroni: 27:53

Sometimes that issue. Yeah. As you say, it's just out of the scope to do Yeah, you have to do the customer satisfaction and making sure everything's Oh, yeah, everything's set up in a boss. Yeah, exactly. So yeah. If someone wants to get in touch with you to hear more about what you do, or just to have a chinwag, where can they find you

Unknown: 28:15

at pin social on everything? Apart from LinkedIn, because I've done the old school, Dan Harris 86.

Aggie Meroni: 28:28

Oh my god, I thought you're joking.

Unknown: 28:31

But I'll bring it out on my merchandise and stuff. So I don't want to get rid of it.

Aggie Meroni: 28:36

It must be tough, though. There must be other Leon Harris's are

Unknown: 28:40

really, really common name, which is I think, why then put a six at the end. It's fine. It's yeah, we're still MSN.

Aggie Meroni: 28:47

So what I'll do is I'll make sure your links are in the show notes so that everyone can like pop along and get in touch with you. And thank you so much for being so candid sharing your story and how you juggle everything, which is immense.

Unknown: 29:02

I've been quite restricted. Yeah, but I

Aggie Meroni: 29:05

mean, every everyone can relate. Everyone's got stuff happens in their lives where they need that flexibility. And I think that is the draw of being freelance you don't have to explain your movements to anyone. So thank you very much for being a guest.

Unknown: 29:19

Thanks for having me.

Aggie Meroni: 29:26

Thank you for listening to this episode of the freelance ads club podcast. If you're a freelance ads manager, don't forget to download the free Client Onboarding Trello you can find in the show notes. If you're a brand or agency looking for support from one of our community, visit our website at the freelance ads club.com to access our member directory. Tune in next time